First of all I´d like to mentionthe recent European tour. What were your impressions like? Can you rememberany highlights or great moments which would you like to mention?
Undoubtedly the highlight was playingon the same bill as Michael Rother and Dieter Moebius. I think if youlook at the bands they have been associated with, Neu!, Kraftwerk, Cluster,Harmonia and not to mention their work with
Brian Eno, it pretty much outlines their importance to electronic music.I think it is very important to know your roots and respect those whohave given you help!
We spent most of the time in Germany,which I'm fond of, especially the East. I was very impressed with thereaction we got in smaller towns, Offenburg, Husum, Jena etc. But theEast of Germany is a fantastic place.
DVOA will appear in Praha in fewweeks (13 / 05). Is it first time you will perform behind former IronCurtain, how do you feel about that and what do you expect? Do you haveany imagination how people here will understand and take your music?
First time I will have performed inthe Czech Republic. Download had a show cancelled in Praha four yearsago but we still went to the city ( which was stunning ) and acted liketourists for the day. I have to say that I'm totally fascinated by theformer Iron Curtain countries. Ironically ( and I say this with a certainamount of trepidation ) I was always respectful of the DDR, Czechoslovakiaetc. I despised the British Government and looked to the Eastern Blockfor inspiration. You've got to understand that the North of England( where I'm from ) isn't anything like the South. As the KLF once said," It's Grim Up North." We felt cheated by the Government.It was sobering when I first went to the East of Germany, to hear someof the stories. I recently went to a museum of the Stasi in Leipzigand it was totally scary. Yet, I have to say that there is an inquisitive,intelligent, friendly, open and charming quality to many of the youngpeople I've met in the East. I'm fascinated by how people are affectedby change and I think that the changes you've experienced over the last10 years have been quite something.
I have no idea about how people willrespond to or understand our music. Mainly because I have no idea whatit's going to sound like yet! No, people usually get into a certainhead space when they see/listen to us. I saw this with Download fanstoo. I hope it's because we give them enough space to think for themselves.That they feel imaginative. I cannot rule out the Praha dynamic either.Praha is a dynamic city. It's a complete honour to be there and I hopeI feel inspired by the city and the people I meet.
You live in Holland and work togetherwith Niels from Legendary Pink Dots now. Do you prepare a new recordingor do just tour together? If any newest recording will be out, couldyou drop the details to our readers?
Yes, we've done quite a lot of recordingbut nothing has been finished yet. Niels and I have known each otherfor several years and it's good to finally be able to work together.He also introduced me to a drummer, Bradley Dunn-Klerxs who is quiteoutstanding. We have decided to create a band together with Frank Verschuuren,who is the Pink Dot's engineer.
What do you feel as the biggest differencebetween Europe and Canada/USA from both artistic and civil point ofview - according to possibilities, club scene, fans, media, artisticfreedom, relationships etc?
The differences are quite profound.Even between Canada and the USA. Strangely enough, I always feel moreat home in the US than I do in Canada. There is a dynamic quality tothe US, sadly missing in Canada. Best typified by the Canadian boastof being politically neutral. They call themselves "fence sitters,"which is a strange way of insulting yourself in my book.
Whereas America is a melting pot of ideas and people. The society isseriously flawed but again, in a strange way, I admire that. Canadianstend to think they're superior. Something to do with an immigrant cultureI suspect. Canada celebrates it's ethnic diversity but the spectre ofracism is never far from the surface. There's a superficial unease.Whereas the US episodically erupts because of it's diversity, Canadajust grumbles away. To me the biggest difference between North Americaand Europe is the way Europeans seem to be more interested in dynamicrelationships. It's OK to debate. It's OK to have strong opinions. InCanada that's regarded in a negative way. I think European society isfar more interested In politics. In what is happening throughout theworld. I suspect that the educational systems in Europe are better too.University Degrees are given away like toilet paper in Canada.
Artistically, It's more complex. Mostbig cities have good access to the arts. Small town USA is often thebest place to play shows. People seem far more appreciative. A goodexample for us was Albuquerque New Mexico, which is a long way fromanywhere. The audience there was incredible, whereas in a city suchas San Francisco or New York City for example, they have the pick ofthe crop and as a result tend to react in a lazy way to bands. EastEurope is great. Again, there's a hunger for art. People are quite relaxed.There's an immediate recognition of where you're coming from, artistically.Has to have something to do with the fact that most of the best musicoriginated from Europe. It has to be said. I'm talking about "experimental"music.I've never seen the pop music industry hit such a miserable low in Europethan at this moment in time. The USA is miles ahead in that regard.The guitar, an instrument I love, seems completely at ease in the handsof musicians from small town USA. Most of the guitar bands that I listento are American.
A universal problem in music howeveris ignorance. I tend to get gigs because of my connections with Download.Which as you know, emerged from Skinny Puppy. Therefore I get a lotof very young Skinny Puppy / Industrial music fans coming to shows.They tend to be very influenced by the superficial aspects of the scene.The clothes, an obsession with bad horror movies, bad hair or whatever.They tend to forget about the bands that came before Puppy. The musicthat Puppy was influenced by and I think that's a very big mistake.There's so much good music out there, if you can only dip your toesinto the water. The Residents said, " Ignorance of your cultureis not considered cool." Very true. Ignorance of what is happeningNOW is also not cool. I can't tell you how depressing it is to playshows in Germany and have audience members tell me they've never heardof Oval or Microstoria or Pluramon or Mouse on Mars or even Neu!, Cluster,Faust, Can. Germany has always been the spiritual home of experimentalmusic and it's so important that we recognise that. That we listen withopen ears instead of an eye in the mirror at our own reflection.
Having said that, I've always foundthat our audiences are kind of responsive to what we do and as we don'ttow the industrial line (I don't even know what industrial music is!) then I think that says something about the people who come to ourshows.
You did many collaborations in thepast you were participating or you were a member of Zoviet France, Downloadfor example. Why have you chosen this style of work, what is most attractivefor you on it?
As for Zoviet France, I was a memberfor a relatively short time. Like a year and a half. I left them 11years ago, so it's a long time ago. I was a member of Download too.From it's inception basically as a band as opposed to just cEvin andDwayne in a studio, until February 1997. I guess two years or so. Duringthat time we recorded Furnace, Microscopic, The Eyes of Stanley Pain,Sidewinder and toured North America and Europe.
I choose to collaborate because it'sa very dynamic process. I love seeing my work being messed around bypeople I admire musically! It's a constantly evolving process. I wasuntil recently living in Vancouver, Canada, which is an awfully longway from anywhere and anybody. So, postal collaboration was a necessity.
Have you been ever working in thestable band?
Ha! Is there a stable band? I doubtit. I have to say that I'm probably not a good band member. I tend tobe quite self-sufficient. I miss Download though, the mission was neverfinished.
What the situation in DVOA was likefrom this point of view? Was the band constituted from stable membersor the people were just changing?
In 1992 it was formed by 3 people butin a space of months it was just me. I've tried to incorporate othersbut long ago I made a vow not to regard DVOA as a band per se. Thatit was fine to include others but as collaborators. DVOA is somethingthat is difficult to share because for me, it's been so much work andI cannot expect that other people will understand that. Having saidall of this, I also see no real future for a one man band. Especiallyin a live setting. I need other people. There has got to be some kindof dynamic interplay on stage.
Actually, what is the differencebetween DVOA and other Mark Spybey´s projects?
DVOA are signed to Invisible Recordsand it's true that I put more time and energy into that project. MarkSpybey is a free agent and chooses to work with other people. DVOA ismy commercial arm! Believe it or not.
Except above mentioned most knowncollaborations you did so much work which is not so known to me whatkind of band is for example Not Breathing which I know from the compilationDrug Test. or Propeller?
Not Breathing is a band from TucsonArizona, although currently based in San Francisco. It's nucleus isDavid Wright. We are both signed to Invisible and a few years ago werecorded an album together called, " A Fire In The Bronx Zoo."There is no doubt in my mind, after playing many shows with Dave, thathe is the most overlooked person in electronic music today. It's criminal.I urge everyone to check out his stuff. He's so good at what he doesand is a brilliant live improviser.
Propeller is my altar-ego. I've released2 cd's on Scratch Records, with a third to come. It's more experimentalthan DVOA.
What exactly you did with Jarboe(SWANS), Mick Harris (SCORN), Jean Yves Theriault (VOI VOD), Z´ev orFrans de Waard (STAALPLAAT, KAPOTTE MUZIEK)?
I sent material to Jarboe and she includedthat on her Anhedoniac album. She's a very fine person, a brilliantperformer. I have just completed an album with Mick Harris for HushushRecords ( http://www.hushush.com ) as part a series called Threesome.Very excited about this one as Mick's beats are wonderful to work with.Absolutely unique.The first installment of that is a cd I did with Ambre,which included members of Imminent Starvation, which is available now.I've never worked with Z'ev but with Zev Asher who is not the same person.Zev Asher was with Roughage and Nimrod. Also a project with Merzbowcalled Flying Testicles. Zev is a film-maker too and currently livesin Toronto. I have been recording a collaborative album with Frans deWaard for years! I regret to say that Frans has always been extremelyprompt in sending me his work but that I have been uncommonly
slow in responding, sorry Frans!
As Orphx will perform in Praha verysoon this special question is aimed on project Antiform (Orphx sideproject) what kind of collaboration was that?
Oh dear me. Another one that got submergedby me. We did an album together by mail, probably 3 years ago now andit's never seen the light of day. Oh dear! I need to talk to them.
You do work as a therapist - canyou tell us something about as I think your work is still great experienceand inspiration for you?
I worked full time as an OccupationalTherapist in Psychiatry for 16 years until November the 25th 1999 whenI went on tour and subsequently moved back to Europe. I hope to returnto this work at some point. Well, work is work of course. I have hadthe pleasure of working with some inspirational people. I have learntsomething about myself along the way. I've also experienced what miserydoes to people and it's far from glamorous. I guess I'm constantly remindedhow resourceful people are, even in the face of adversity and illness.How creative people are.
What is the biggest non-musical inspirationfor your creative process?
Erm. I feel lustful of life. Still fascinatedby minutae. I can read a page and think for hours. See an image andget carried away. As long as I feel like this, there is a need for meto be creative. I'm nothing special!
DVOA are very active on Internetyour Team DVOA of musicians, management and Internet technicians isdoing incredible job. You did 10hrs live radio transmission years agofrom Chicago lab. Do you plan something like this now?
Thanks. Actually I feel very lazy inthat regard. North Americans have a BIG advantage over Europeans inas far as they don't have to pay for local calls, so they tend to beon the internet all the time. I'm quite ignorant of most technical mattersmyself, which is why it's fun to hook up with people who can utilisenew ideas. You should visit the lab site, http://www.the-lab.com andsee how far they've gone since that broadcast. Most impressive. I amalways open to interesting offers but to be honest, my job is to makemusic. I feel involved in that process
Do you have any further plans withInternet at the moment?
No. I give full responsibility to anyonewho wants to work with me on any Internet projects.
Once in one of your previous interviewsyou´ve said The net is a goldmine for anyone who is generally excludedfrom mainstream culture. Do you have any vision about possible conflictbetween corporations´ tendency to censore and control the informationflow...?
There seems to be perpetual conflictbetween corporate society and the freedom of information. Figures really.It's all a matter of control I think. If there's big money to be madefrom the Internet ( and I'm not sure if there is yet ) then you canbet your bottom dollar that the corporate world will seek to controlit more effectively. By the way, as well as the net being a goldminefor people who are excluded from mainstream culture, it's also a goldminefor psychopaths and troublesome 14 year old trench coated rich, boredkids from Godknowswhere, Suburbia. I have to admit that my interestin the internet peaked a couple of years ago. Since then, I use it tobook train tickets, as a library or to keep in touch with people. Ibecame very disillusioned by it, largely due to the presence of veryirritating people.
Actually, do you feel any censorshipor control over your work in States? Are there any printed (for example)hard-to-find materials?
No, none at all. I despise their licensinglaws. I mean, in some places you have to be 21 to go into a pub. Somebars insist on seeing everyones I.D. I keep saying to them, " I'm38 years of age, do I look like I'm underage ?" Completely bizarre.It's probably easier to buy a gun than get into a bar.
You are painter originally, thenyour interest led you to the poetry, to the physicality of languagewhich led you to the sound - to the physicality of sound. What otherartistic space are you about to explore?
More of the same I guess! I'm reallyinto cooking and gardening. I want to design my own herb garden.
What for example about your planswith DVOA visuals CD-ROM?
A friend of mine did that as part ofa college course but I'm not sure if I ever saw it. Aren´t CD-ROM'Skind of boring ? I'm not sure that I could create any particularly arrestingvisual images to go with my music. So I'd rather not bother but if anyoneelse wanted to do this, within reason, I probably wouldn't say no. I'mtotally bored of pop music videos. So far I'm less han thrilled withthe visual component to multi-media work. Nothing that someone likeDerek Jarman didn't do 100 times better with only a super8.
You call your music as The MusicFor the Eyes. Can you explain your concept and understanding of yourmusic and sound? (For example i feel the flows of energy instead ofany pictures, structured images � just unstructured variable flows.)
From what I gather, we process informationin different parts of the brain, which allows us to interpret sound,words and images in highly individualised ways. If we process informationlogically, we try to understand it. If you try to process my music logically,I think you'll probably be disappointed. There's no need to try andgrasp this music in your hand and analyse it. What happens ( and toa certain extent I think this is an intentional part of most experimentalforms of art ) is that because of it's somewhat amorphous structure,we are encouraged to think about it in a creative way. So sound caninspire visual images. Hence music for the eyes, which is by no meansa new concept.
I've tried to make music that encouragesthe listener to be creative by not feeling as if I have to work withinclassic song structures, although I admire those that can do that andstill sound as if they have something new to say. At the same time,it's important to feel as if I am able to limit myself. Hence the reasonwhy I've usually resorted to using the same kinds of instruments ortechnical processes. I have a fear of explosion! That with too muchequipment, one tries to do too much and space within music is very important.Space creates the potential for contemplative thought. Overkill is gratuitous.
I'm not conducting science experimentsbut at the same time, what I do is perhaps more controlled and restrainedthan you might have thought.
I like the idea of energy flows by theway. We did a piece with Download called, " Energy Plan, "that very much dealt with the consistency of sound. One of my favouritebands, Main seem very preoccupied by sound consistency in a composedmanner, as opposed to the granular synthesists of this world who areobsessed with the components of sound in a highly technical way.
As you said you do songs or pieces.How do you compose what is the proportion between improvisation andfirmly prepared structure? What goes first sound or melody or structureor feeling?
Structure is always dictated by thesounds that emerge. I play with sounds and compose with them. Soundsalways come first, exploration.
Krautrock was your biggest influenceand kick in the beginning. What else for example ethno, classical, earlyindustrial music? When you actually started doing music?
When I started to make music, it wasneo-classical stuff, punk, German music and bands like Hawkwind, thatnever really stood firmly within any genre. I have always had eclectictastes. When I first made music nobody had heard
of Industrial music. I did like Throbbing Gristle, mainly their popstuff to be honest. John Peel was a huge influence. I first heard TheResidents, The Pop Group, This Heat etc on his show. He's brilliant.
Which personalities became the biggestinspiration for you? Can you explain your appeal and respect for JosephBeyus, Antonin Artaud and Edward Lear ?
Footballers. Bobby Charlton, GeorgeBest, Nobby Stiles. Manchester United, 1968.
Beuys hit me in the stomach. I've neverresponded so physically to anyone's art. He transformed his ideas intoart. Most artists transform redundant theory into art at the expenseof creativity. Beuys was direct, he cut out the
middle-man. Artaud was a very extreme character and I admire that. Heput his own well-being on the line.
Whereas his descent into madness was not at all attractive, he had acommitment to his work that was completely engrossing. Edward Lear madea career out of being nonsensical. What better way to be?
What do you think is common for allthose people?
A celebration of eccentricity.
Whom do you personally respect fromtodays world?
Lot's of people I guess. People suchas Tony Benn the British left-wing politician, who in his seventiesis still as bright and effective as ever. I guess people who can followtheir convictions, whilst maintaining their respect for others. There'sgot to be some dignity about the way people go about their business.
You still are not very friendly withDJ´s scene and all that remixes flood or has it changed?
I don't think so. I still regard DJ'sas fashionable thieves. At best, they are passable recyclers. Quitewhy we should be so willing to celebrate the "talents" ofthieves and recyclers is beyond me. Remixes can be interesting. Dependswho does them.
You were born in Northern England,then moved to Vancouver / Canada, now living in Millingen a/d Rijn /Netherlands. As I can see you are very cosmopolitan what does bringyou this lifestyle both from positive and negative point of view?
After travelling a bit, I've decidedto move back to the North of England. Although, if work was better andlanguage not so much of a barrier, I could easily live in Holland orGermany. I recommend living in an alien culture! It makes you appreciateyour own country, or your own cultural identity. I'm totally NorthernEnglish working class. Completely. I have no desire to change this.No desire to be upwardly mobile! I don't know if I'm cosmopolitan. Ithink the only thing that practically separated me from the kids I wentto school with and who ended up staying in my home town, is the factthat I went to University or Polytechnic as it was called then. ThatI escaped and was able to see things, experience things and move on.I know lot's of working class kids who got into art or music or operaor books. You just have to open your eyes and the sad fact is, thatfor centuries, those things were
deliberately kept from the working class because they are actually powerfultools. I hate to use the term, "self development," becauseI have a big problem with anal thinking and I think those that claimto be developing themselves by doing things like psychotherapy or drummingin circles or whatever are comfortably numb. There's a BIG differencebetween needing psychotherapy and doing it because you didn't get onwith your Mommy because she wouldn't buy you an Action Man in a spacesuit.
Every human being is going throughpermanent transition. What do you think will be your deal in the nearestfuture?
Are we all so committed to change? I'mnot sure we are really. I think I can empathise with those who haveto take quantum leaps out of necessity but not with those who do sobecause it strokes their ego's. All I know is, I'm getting older. Ican see that. I can acknowledge that I change due to a combination offactors. I have to constantly kill off the need to just cave in. Comfortcan be deadly. For the past five months I've lived out of suitcases,with friends or on the road. All of my possessions are in storage somewhereand I've been unable to live with my wife due to the fact that in orderto move back to England I have to either put my cat in 6 months quarantineor live with him in another European country. So, I'm living with MisterCat in Holland rather than have him put into a cage somewhere. That'swhat I'm dealing with.
What are your up-to-date musical,other artistic plans?
I hope to have some nice news soon.I have formed a new project called The Happy Submarines with Niels,Frank
and Bradley. I also have more shows planned in Europe after a supportslot on the forthcoming Legendary Pink Dots tour of North America. Anew DVOA cd is being released by Invisible in June called, " FrankiePett Presents The Happy Submarines Playing the Music of Dead VoicesOn Air." Then the cd I mentioned with Mick Harris, then anotherPropeller cd. I'm also part of Michael Karoli's band, Sofortkontakt!He is the guitarist from Can. We have shows in Japan and probably more.Hopefully lot's more. I love playing with Michael.
I don't know though. I just want togrow herbs and make a home somewhere in the countryside with my wife,watch some decent football, ride bikes, cook good antipasti, bake bread.
Any music or label you would recommendto our readers some discovery?
Well, Kranky is a great little label.My favourite band right now is LOW. I'm listening to Syd Barrett a lot.The box set is nice.
Your last words in this interview?
Thanks so much.
Thanx for your answers, wish you allthe best and see you soon.
Mark Spybey - Tom Saivon 27 / 04 / 00